UFC 320の余韻：ローラ・サンコとコーチのジョン・ウッド | The Bohnfire
You need like a little animation for every time you just drop an absolute bar of effect. Yeah, I had no idea. That’s crazy. Welcome to a special edition of the Bonfire podcast cage side here at the UFC Apex with Laura Senko who will be uh calling the action penultimate week here at Dana White’s Contender Series. Laura, uh are you sad? Are you sad when the season gets close to the end? I’m sad we don’t have a fire in front of us. Can we light a fire in the apex? Is that legal? Take PR with Probably frowned upon. Probably frowned upon. Um, yeah. Listen, I I love the show so much. It is, I will admit to you, very exhausting for me because I’m the only one that does every single episode. So, I’m flying back and forth. So, it’s a little bit bittersweet. I do I do love this show. And so, yes, the penultimate um yeah, the penultimate show being here. It’s kind of crazy that the season’s wrapping up pretty soon, but there’s a little part of me that’s um probably okay with it. Also, I think week nine will be in the books by the time most people see this, but I think going into this one, uh I think 45 fighters already signed and the record’s what, 46. So, I don’t know. Does that speak to you? Is that a talent thing? Just a roster turnover thing? What does that say to you? I think it’s all of the above. I mean, this is I was actually just talking to someone a second ago. This to me is one of the better seasons we have ever had. And what really stuck out to me, listen, it’s it’s been this way for a few years now growing, but to me, this season was by far the most international. There was a uh I’m never going to remember what week it is because they’re all a little bit of a blur to me, but there was a week I maybe six or seven. Um I remember looking there were nine countries represented on a fiveight card, which is insane. It’s absolutely insane. And it just it speaks to the the global reach of the sport. um the global reach of the UFC and yeah, it’s been a very uh very successful season contractwise. Yeah, seriously. For the ladies. Yeah, even uh you don’t need to win on this one apparently, but you just got to fight with the heart and they’ll bring you in 100%. I mean, that’s that’s been the message on this show, but um I love when that message actually, you know, comes to fruition and we see it happen. And yeah, that takes some some personal uh I guess you might say vicarious pride in the both female fights. Having all four participants being signed is pretty cool. And they deserve it. They went out there and they were the embodiment of what Dana wants to see on this show, which is effort. It’s grit. It’s determination. It’s go out there, give it everything you got, and even if you don’t win, you might end up winning in the end. How differently do you feel you have to call these fights than like an actual UFC fight? That’s actually a really great question. It is pretty different. I mean, the calling the the the mechanisms of calling the fight are obviously the same, but um and often it’s a producer reminding us because we do kind of go into normal fight night mode. Um, hey, this show is different and you do kind of have to keep that in mind and we try to remind the audience of that as well. It’s really, it’s not at all about I mean, it is about winning the fight, but almost more so considering we just talk about losers getting contracts. Um, it is more so about putting it all out there. And that is so much easier said than done as well. Like I almost feel guilty sometimes saying like, uh, last week was a perfect example. I’m forgetting the fighter’s name, but the the Russian fighter who had a great fight, really smart game plan, executed it, got the win. Um, but Dana didn’t see that thing that is necessary on this show. I think we’ll see him in the UFC, you know, pretty soon. But and that’s the other kind of takeaway too is like even if you don’t get a contract here if if you do have a good performance, you know, you’re on a short list. We’ve seen that many times. Yeah. Mick Maynard and Sean Shelby like they’re going to have that in your mind if someone pops up. So it’s uh yeah, the the job interview side of it and then the actual uh how do you get in the USC? So yeah, we’ll see how this goes and I’m sure it’s going to be a record number of contracts. Obviously we’ll probably get over 50 here. Yeah, I think I think we will again given the fact that this year we had two losers get contracts. Yeah, we’ll probably break the record, which is crazy to think about when you look back on season one and there were guys like Chris Curtis spinning. What was it like a wheel kick or something crazy? Some sweet chin music. Yeah. And then uh they’re like, “No, no, we don’t want them.” But yeah, it’s it’s the show has certainly evolved as the UFC has evolved in terms of the way that the the roster is put together. And you know, I think it was um the Perth card was over 50% uh graduates of Contender Series, which is pretty pretty cool to see at this point. Um when someone says UFC 320 and you think back, what is uh what is the thing first thing that’s going to come to your mind when you think back at that event? First thing that comes to mind is just Yeah. That again, you know, it’s so the disrespect I saw someone else write this. The disrespect of a recycled meme really speaks to the punctuation of that win for Alex Pereira. Pretty I mean I don’t think anybody could have predicted that he would have won so emphatically so definitively. I mean maybe he and his team would have but given how the last fight went and how closely contested it was. I think a lot of people including myself I I kind of I had him picked to win the fight but never in a million years would I have said oh yeah round one. How what was the 80 seconds? No. No, I would not have. Fastest MMA win ever. Unbelievable. Unbelievable. Pretty cool. Yeah. It’s It sucks though that we have to sit here now. It was after the first fight, Alex’s side. I wasn’t 100% and now it’s Mega’s side, the rib injury, like all that stuff. I don’t know. Is this like a a modern MMA issue just in general? Like it’s you can’t just take the loss on the chin and move on. There always has to be something. It feels more and more now than ever. Yeah. And I think to just the nature of the beast of everybody being in everybody’s business, it’s going to come out regardless of whether the fighter sits down and does an interview about it. So part of it’s on them, part of it’s on like just the fact that we have so much information about everybody at this point. Um but yeah, there’s there’s part of me that like I I’ve always respected the guys that kind of try to keep it quiet and just sort of take the losses on the chin. Yeah. Doesn’t feels like it’s more and more rare these days. is I know Dustin Porier was on the show last week kind of talking about that same stuff too like he always keeps it in ex Dustin is a perfect example there there are a number of guys um but Dustin definitely is at the top of the list where they’re sort of old school in that mentality of like I guarantee Dustin Porier was banged up in about coming into about every single fight but they’re going to tell you it’s the best camp ever and you know they’re also not going to tell you after they lose what they were dealing with leading up to it but that’s just sort of it’s the story of being a a prize fighter What uh what’s most appealing to you when you think about Alex Perez’s future? Is it like stick around, defend this belt again, start another reign or man, all this heavyweight, White House, Jon Jones, all these things? So tricky because I’m gonna I’m gonna contradict myself if we talk about Morab because for Alex, I want to see he’s such a he’s already doing such extraordinary things. I feel like we as fans want to see how far we can push the envelope. like how extraordinary can he be? So, yes, I would like to see him at some point. I don’t know if it’s next. Um because I would love to see that Carlos fight, but at some point I I’ve got to see him at heavyweight. Like, how incredible would that be for that to be his story if he were to be able to win a fight or even a title at heavyweight? That would be insane. Um, but then in the same breath, I also appreciate guys like Pantosia and and I feel like Morab who are just gonna absolutely clean out and clean it out again, you know, their respective division. Yeah, I mean that’s what we’ve seen the greatest champions, right? They are able to knock off other contenders once, twice, but yeah, he’s been calling for this for a while. I feel like Alex like really wants that, but I don’t know. Dana doesn’t seem too enthusiastic. I mean, don’t call the guy 185. He’s had more fights in the UFC at light heavyweight. He has the second most light heavyweight title fight wins in history. Tied with tied with Chuck Liddell at five. And then Jon Jones is way up there at like 13 or 14. But right there, a little animation. You need like a little animation for every time you just drop an absolute bar of a fact. Yeah, I had no idea. That’s crazy. He’s already there, but I don’t know what decision they’re going to make. Jon Jones, we we don’t know where he is in life right now with everything that happened with his brother. Next year is going to be a fascinating year. It’s going to be And in every regard. Um yeah, really really sad to see um what happened in John’s immediate family. And you know, people think that that stuff shouldn’t necessarily change a fighter schedule, but like they’re real people. You know, I can’t imagine dealing with a loss like that and even caring about fighting anymore to be honest with you. But it ch when death happens that close to you, it changes your perspective on on life and at some point you’re like this is just this is cool. It’s incredible, but like it’s not fleeting. It’s fleeting. Exactly. Yeah. Yeah. It’s tough for John. We’ll see when he speaks and all that stuff, but uh yeah, for now, Alex, I don’t know. He claims he likes to be so active, so feel like maybe if they’re going to Australia and, you know, February, maybe he makes a return. Yeah, I I would love to see him fight Carlos. And if he gets a win over Carlos, I mean, I just I got to see him I have to see him at heavyweight at some point. But then, you know, I saw some people arguing that Yuri jumped the line um with his with his knockout. I don’t think so just because they’ve they’ve been there. We’ve already seen that fight as amazing as it was and as amazing as Yuri’s own sort of Phoenix rising from the ashes moment was, but I want to see the Carlos fight first. Do you think uh Morab speaking of him is he locked up fighter of the year three title defenses or do you think that Jack Del Matalena if he can do something in New York beating Bal who was on like a 12 10 or 11 fight winning streak and then Islam is on 15 does he at least make that conversation interesting he definitely makes the conversation interesting 100% he makes the conversation interesting I still I have to give it to Morab I have to give it to Rob being able to be that active as a champion and I say this every time I talk about Morab lately To operate at the championship level is one thing. To continue to evolve in a noticeable way as a champion is otherworldly. And the fact that the guy is continues to add tools to the tool belt, becoming more of a finish. I realized he didn’t finish last time, but he almost did. Yeah. And he’s just becoming more and more dangerous, which is only going to increase his stardom. And yeah, I think he’s got fighter of the year personally. Well, especially if he gets the fourth fight. I mean, that would be game over. There would be no argument on the board at that point. Yeah. Do you think that’s a bad idea though in your mind for anybody else? Literally anybody else. We have so many cautionary tales about overactive champions. I just feel like that man is cut from a different mold. Um, and I noticed it like obviously we all see how he fights, but if you spend any time around him when he’s not fighting, he is as busy a person as he is a fighter. Like um two two fights ago, so it would have been his rematch with Ali. Um, I ended up at this big dinner the night before the fights and there were like 30 people there and he’s literally walking around, serving everybody, saying hi to everybody. You know, it’s like I’m like Robbie, you you’re a lot of fighters don’t go to their like a big get together meal the night before a title fight for good reason because at least for me, I don’t know about you. Maybe it’s because I’m an introvert naturally. Like those social interactions take little bits of energy out of me and I have to kind of just like be a recluse before I’m going to do something big. That man is an endless gas tank in every sense of the word. So for him, I just I don’t do it. Is there anything Potrion can do to make that a more interesting fight than last time? You think though? I don’t know. I don’t know. Por has looked fantastic. Said he was 50% in an interview today. Did he really? That’s But maybe I tend to believe him because look at his last few performances. He’s looked phenomenal. And but I just don’t know if stylistically you can change that much, you know, and and again with Morab getting better as well. That’s a It’s a big Excuse me. That’s a big gap to close. I just ate. Sorry. Sorry, guys. Feel like you just need to knock Morab out. Like that’s your You got to go all in on on the KO because I don’t see I mean I don’t know. Umar had some stuff with him going on, but then he hurt his hand. But I don’t know. Like it’s if you’re game planning to win a decision over this guy, that feels like the wrong approach. Absolutely the wrong approach. But even the guys who go in there talking about knockouts, he’s got a great chin. His defense is getting better and better. like there was a time where that was the obvious game plan against Morab and it felt realistic, you know, in the beginning of this run, the first few fights of this run. Um I remember him getting, you know, rocked and kind of almost out of there and then he’d find a way to wrestle again. You just you don’t you don’t worry about that as much anymore. Obviously, it’s always on the table, but um he’s he has become incredibly well-rounded. He’s very skilled. Okay, a few more things I want to touch on. Did you see this Conor McGregor stuff today? Thoughts? I panicked. I know you’re like, “Oh, I literally did.” I was like, “No.” And then I did the math. I was like, “Okay, it’s fine. It’s fine.” I mean, it’s it’s a weird thing. Like, uh, very dated back. We know. We’re not going to joke around. Like, we know he took himself out of the pool. He was trying to do stuff to help him recover. Um, it’s just weird. It feels weird for this to come out like now on this day after he says yesterday, I’m like, I’m taking a break from social media. See you guys later. I’m going to log off. Yeah, it you never know. Well, like I’m assuming he knew this was coming down the pipe and just didn’t want to have to deal with the, you know, barrage of BS. But I mean, this is something that he and his team have known about, something the commission’s known about. So, listen, they backdate stuff all the time. That’s not it’s they’re not pulling any special favors for him, and I’m just really grateful that the the timing works out um in everyone’s favor. Does this make you feel better or worse or indifferent to him fighting next summer at the White House? Uh, indifferent. I was already very high on it. Like I I feel other than a brief few minutes when I opened my phone a few hours ago was just like literally lost my mind. I was I literally I actually texted a friend of mine because I I I work in a a company with that Connor is an investor and I was like no. And then I deleted the message because I finally did the math and I was like never mind. It’s fine. It’s fine. It’s fine. We’re it’s fine. We’re good. No, I’m I I have a lot of confidence that he will be there and he will be um as ready as he can be at this at this point in his career. I think for Connor, it’s about things that have meaning and historical importance. And I I I know we said this about Noce that like, “Oh, this is crazy. We’re never doing this again. Fight Island. We’re never doing this again.” I just can’t imagine that we’re ever doing this one again. Yeah, White House is definitely going to be a one-on-one. I’d be or one of one. I’d be shocked. Uh, does it need to be Michael Chandler standing across the cage? I don’t know that it needs to be, but I think it should be. I think it should be. I think that’s a an appropriate matchup. I just wonder I’m curious to see how they if is it is it a BMF title? Is it I mean, they have to have them at the top of the marquee. Do they just say screw it, we’re not going to worry about putting a title on this? You know, kind of break all the rules. And if Dana says they’re going to make it the greatest fight card in US history, you have to add at least a couple fights on there. I mean, does anyone sit here? Are they going to cry if Connor’s at the top of the card? We all know what’s what. You can put some title fights below him. Exactly. You can you can put, you know, Kayla versus Amanda. You can, you know, I keep hearing these rumblings of what if Rhonda shows up. That would be incredible. Not Yeah. What do you think about that? Because I asked Dana about that the press conference and he was like, we still talk like she’s kind of getting back in. She’s had her kids like more getting back in shape, but she wrote that book, right? And she did all those interviews where she was talking about like a gust of wind would almost give me a concussion. Like I went in there, Amanda touched me once and it was like, you know, seeing stars, can you license someone who’s been that open about like head, you know, trauma issues? Yeah, you make you make a really good point. I don’t I I don’t know that I can speak to that. Has she commented at all on any intention or or are we just excited about the imagination and the possible? She put out that video. She said, “I’m finding my love for the sport again.” And she’s working with some people that she wasn’t before, like you know. Um, so I don’t know. It’s hard to say. She doesn’t do much media, but I think she’s a very intentional person. I don’t think she’s putting that out for no no reason at all. But again, I see all that other stuff. I’m like, you said all the you went on a media tour about how much issues you had with your head. Well, perhaps though the the amount of I mean, she’s had how many years off now? The last fight will have been I think it was December 2017. So, we’re coming up on nine years. I maybe that would be the point of all of it is that that was how she felt at the time and that was the truth at the time. But I mean you’re talking about many many years of recovery and taking care of yourself and not sparring. And you know a lot that’s one of the biggest things with fighters is not that they fight too frequently. It’s that they don’t they don’t take off of hard even hard rolling. You can you can get a concussion from that. So they just have a hard time not training and she’s been truly resting for a long time. So, you know, if she if she comes out and says, “I can do this.” Like, I have full faith that she knows she can and feels medically capable of doing it, is ready to be in there. You should take stay by the phone. You might get a call. Exactly. Um, okay. Last talking point here. Uh, we’re waiting for the Paramount card announcements to come out. What What’s your gut saying? I feel like it’s going to be Ilia Tapora. That feels pretty clear, but will it be Patty Pimble or will it be Justin Gate? We saw Armen get booked against Dan Hooker and Qar, so don’t think it’s going to be him. Feels like a twoman race now between Patty and Justin Gai. It does feel like that. But I wonder if are we coming out the gate with a numbered event. So it’s on Paramount Plus, isn’t it? So I asked Dana pretty much this question. I don’t know if they’re going to do like a fight night or something. It feels like it would make sense to just go straight into a numbered event. I asked like would that be on CBS or would it be on Paramount Plus? He said probably Paramount, which makes sense. Drive the subscribers, all that stuff. Stack the deck. Um so yeah, that’s what I think it’ll be. Paramount Plus by a numbered card. I think I mean if you’re talking about numbers I think Elilia versus Gate would be pretty awesome. Arman deserves it but in terms of just two insanely like I love Justin and I’ve spent enough time around him where sometimes you kind of like forget how big of a star someone is when you are around them in settings. And then I did like a um meet and greet fan type thing with him maybe a year or two ago. I could not get over there was a line of people for Justin Gachi that was well over an hour long. Well, I mean he’s a massive superstar obviously. So is Ilia Toporia. Um I think Arman was probably the hardest the harder stylistic matchup but if you’re looking for eyeballs I don’t know. What do you do with Patty then you think? Oh that would be another eyeball fight. Yeah, like that one. I just worry thing I worry and this is all due respect to Patty. No hate at all, but like you have this opportunity right here to do him an Ilia now. If you put Patty against Max Hallway or Armen or something, I feel like you’re you’re risking this fight if it doesn’t go his way. Yes, I think so. I think so. I think they want to save Patty for um Spain or you know something really huge. But maybe that’s I don’t know, Mike. I don’t know that. I don’t not a match. You’re allowed to give opinions. This is what we do here on the show. But we sit by the bonfire and we just talk about the sport. But no, I get it. I think what you said earlier uh is very on point. Next year feels like it could be a truly like special and unique year for the sport. I know a lot of people will say like 2015 2016 were the best years for the UFC as a company. I think four a million pay-per-view sales in 2016. So like 10 years later, maybe we’re getting something special here. I will say that um from everything I know uh behind the scenes, the partnership with Paramount Sky Dance is going to be unbelievable. I think a lot of us felt like, you know, if we move away from ESPN, we’re going to miss out on um some of the the the other advertising that, you know, helps on the NBA finals, all that type of stuff. But from everything I have heard, they are going full out red carpet. Like they really really see this as the future of their platform. And I I’m expecting very very big things. It’s not just going to be like, oh, there it is. They’re they’re very invested um in what they’re doing. their whole executive team of CBS, Paramount, um, Sky Dance came out here two or three weeks ago, had this huge summit. Um, I was lucky enough to host a Q&A, so I got to hear everything firsthand and um, it’s a big some some big stuff happening next year. It’s exciting exciting tease material. Uh, last thing on you, when are you calling a cardigan next like UFC event? That’s a great question. I’m calling Abu Dhabi. So, I’ve got a pay-per-view coming up. Breaking news here from Yeah. That’s exciting. Um, give us a tiny little preview. Which which title fight are you more hyped for here? Well, listen, I mean, obviously being a smaller woman, I love the straw weights. Being a, you know, I’m a huge fan of grappling, so the nerd in me is very excited to see Reena Janjoba um, versus Mackenzie Durn. The technique of that I’m excited about. But come on, Tom Asol. Like, he’s been gone too long. The king of the north is returning. Like I just I I love the um the grandiosity of of of a heavyweight title fight. Nothing nothing beats that. How much harder is it to prepare for a contender series to a fight night event to a pay-per-view? You know, it’s it’s just a different version of hard like the the digging in and the finding tape on these guys is the hardest part. Um, and then like formulating uh a story that you can tell very quickly and you know in a in an to get people to understand who they are you know in a short am short amount of time is tricky. A pay-per-view is just a lot. And you know just speaking totally uh vulnerable here like I I’m well aware that when I like you know I had the one pay-per-view two years ago and I was really happy with how that went and the reception was good. Um, but I know that every time I I do a pay-per-view, there’s a whole audience that isn’t used to hearing me that only wa that only watches pay-per-views. And so, you know, there’s a lot of pressure to to do it right and to do my best. And I will always do my best and always do my homework. But yeah, I get it’s really the only time I get nervous anymore because I just realize how important it is to, you know, to represent to to do a good job in those big spots. Was the last one you did with Anak and DC or was it Anak and Bisbing? Yeah, same crew. Yeah. Yeah, it’ll be great. And and we’ve done we did Mexico City together, Anakin DC and I. So, like, you know, it’s it’s a group I’m very familiar with and I know the flow will be good. It’s just like I gota, you know, gotta got to nail it as best I can. Well, that’s awesome. Full circle on there with the commentary. Start out with contenders and then you give us some news. So, awesome. Really appreciate you being here and doing this as always. Uh we’ll hopefully catch up soon. I’m going to do a little uh magic here. Podcast magic. I’m going to take a break and then I’ll be back with John Wood at Syndicate MMA and we’ll talk to him a little bit about Morab Deval. I’m too old. Thank you so much, Laura. I appreciate you. Thanks, Mike. Appreciate it. Back here on the Bonfire podcast as we do a little tour around Las Vegas at Syndicate MMA with coach John Wood. Uh one of coach of the year front runners. John, is this I know it’s hard to kind of compare and contrast, but you walk here, you see all the big fights, the belts, like so far as we sit here a couple months left in 2025, does this feel like one of your better, more successful years? Yeah. Uh, you know, last year was really really good also and it’s just it’s just hasn’t the last two years have just been compiling and it’s been like a non-stop run and obviously the the the the terror that that Morab is going on makes it, you know, that much better. Um, but yeah, hell of a year, man. Com from from last year to all the way to now has been pretty much nothing but but success and wins and everything’s going in the right direction. The team is just awesome. So it it feels really good, you know, but just like MMA in itself is I never I never try to get too excited. I never try to get too down. You got to kind of keep that even kill because that [ __ ] can turn in a second, you know. So I always make sure I’m I temper all my uh you know my expectations. Seeing what Morab devel wins like this is unprecedented stuff. Only seven other champions have done this before. So can you at least get a little high off that? Oh yeah. Yeah. I mean, like what Morav is doing is, and I’ve said this before, he’s going on a legendary kind of run right now. And if he can keep doing what he’s doing, and I know what he wants to do is fight one more time this year and break that record. He wants to be the first guy to do that. And it really just comes down to if the UFC is going to let him, you know, I think they have other plans, but um, you know, honestly, I feel like they owe that to him. they’ve, you know, he’s stepped up a couple times and done some fights that, you know, necessarily weren’t healthy for and that didn’t want to do at the right time, but um hopefully they let him do it and, you know, he’s got a plan because he wants to he wants to get December and then March and then White House and then see I’m sure he’ll probably try to do a four again next year. So, it’s pretty crazy, man. It really is. It’s um it’s one of those things when you sit back and you’re just like, “Wow.” You know, it is it is kind of mind-blowing to be attached to something that that is so special, you know, but it it it’s so weird because we’re just here doing the same things we do every day. Morab is literally in in the room training with all the guys every day doing the same thing that everybody does here, you know, and that’s kind of the thing that we’ve built at Syndicate is a is a team, you know, team atmosphere and and a and a culture that everybody feeds off everybody. No one is no one’s bigger than anybody else and you would never know from coming in. He he came in today and just watched practice. You know, he brought his brothers in to watch practice and hung out and just, you know, he’s just one of the guys. So, you got to kind of like sometimes pinch yourself and remind yourself, holy [ __ ] this is really this is really special. It’s so interesting because you me that you have a bunch of great guys in the room that always happen, but there’s like game day players, right? Like the guys, they get the bigger fights and that’s the whole sport. Can you show up and can you succeed in that moment or do you kind of take the step back? Um, can you tell with certain guys, especially like him, like that he has that that side of him, too? Oh, yeah. You know, as as a coach, there there’s there’s a few people that that can be built into, but there is definitely guys that I mean, there’s guys we have here now that I that that are not so good in the room, but they show up on fight night and they are spot on, you know. And there’s guys and vice versa. There’s room. There’s guys that are killer in the room. Not so much to those they have here, but I’ve seen it before where there’s guys that are killers in the room and guys that don’t show up. And Mor Rob is a guy who shows up everywhere. He he shows up in the room, shows up in the sparring, shows up in the fights. And um you know, he he’s just like I said, when he first got here, he had that drive. You knew he had that drive. You knew there was no there was no quitting him on the mat. He was always hardworking, you know, trains two, three times a day. the guy is a grinder. But I I really didn’t know that he was at first just from the first few times of working with him that he was going to be what he is. And then after a few months of working with him, I was like, “Holy [ __ ] this guy’s different.” You know, this guy is really different. How did you guys get to know each other for the first time? So, you know, being Vegas, everybody comes out of Vegas being the fight capital. The the the UFCPI is a block from here. You know, it’s literally you could throw a rock and hit it if you got a good arm. Um, so when that came out here, there’s an influx of fighters from all over the world. Just show up every day. Fighters show up every single day. Just move here. And for the PI, which still kind of blows my mind because I would think that the first thing you would want to do is like find a gym and go and do that. But, but it happens every single day. Guys move out here. They know there’s a couple good gyms to go to and they just figure they’re going to fit in. So, he was one of those ones that uh like five, six years ago now, he he started popping in. um from New York and he would come in and he’d start, you know, hanging out here and Aljo had made the move and he was going back and forth and he just started spending more and more time, you know, and it was like about the I think it was right before the Stamon fight, the Cody Stamon fight or even the fight before that um that he was here and you know with someone like that I was watching him and I just noticed he was good in the room. He’s a good guy. He’s good vibe. like you there’s Rob’s one of the best people I know and so he started to fit you know that way and I was like I like this guy you know and and but he kept going back and forth and so I let him kind of let him want to make the decision that he wanted to be here and so we would get on and I saw he would work with the guys really good and after about a year you know he’d come up to me and he’s like coach you know can we start working we started working together and I was like you know and then I had to figure out how he worked because I’ve said this where Morab has MMA add. He’s just like, you teach something and he’s just, you know, able to start sparring all of a sudden, you know, during practice in the middle of technique. But I also realize the man only needs one. He needs to see something one time. As soon as you show him one time, I swear to God, I’ve never seen anything like it. He’ll do it live and sparring. Perfect. You know, so once I adapted and figured out how he trained, we kind of started hitting it off. And then I figured out how I need to train him. And it just became, you know, we got closer and closer and and he started seeing the things that I was teaching him work. And he’s one of those guys once you get him to believe what you’re trying to get him to believe and he sees it works is off to the moon. You know, he takes it and runs with it. And so we just really kind of like slow played it for the first year or two and then we just realized, man, this is a great combination. Everything’s going the right direction and it’s been nothing but, you know, great since. You know, he’s a great teammate, great partner, great leader. Um he’s a good friend. Like it’s everything, you know. So it’s been it’s been so good over the years and I think we did it the right way where we kind of both, you know, made sure that was the right situation and obviously it it looks like it is. How do you determine who you embrace in that way comes into this because as you say so many fighters coming through. I’m sure a lot of people want to come in here and work with you even if it’s just for like the sparring or the training. Maybe not the specific coaching but how do you filter that? So, you know, something that syndicate we’re trying to do is is run this more like a professional sports team. Like, that’s the one thing with MMA, a lot of it’s the wild, wild west. A lot of it’s just chaos. We had a fighter today, you know, very much today who just showed up and wanted to just think he was going to be on the team. And that’s not how we do things. The way I look at things is that you have to be first and foremost, you have to be able to add something to our team. If you come in here and you know you’re not a good training partner or maybe you’re really really you’re you’re a talented guy. We we’ve turned down UFC fighters. We have a certain culture and a certain fit that that we we know the system that we have works and if the person buys in and we can see that they fit into that system and that they we like them and they like us and it all works then then we go forward with it. But like it’s not for everybody. And you know um especially here in Vegas like the culture in Vegas is is pretty crazy man. And I I just I I’ve not been a part of that for years. It’s like we have a team. We have something special. If you want to be a part of it and you want to be here with us, great. If you want to be everywhere else, great. No problem. Go be everywhere else. But we’re trying to do it different. And we’re trying to do it to where we have team meetings, coaching staff. We have a full staff. We we meet weekly with the the uh the coaches have a weekly meeting, we have tape studies, we have everything. We try to take out all of the all of the the problems for the fighter and put it on us and we try to take care of everything. And if the person wants that kind of, you know, situation where we’re here to make your life easier and you think that you can get better, then it’s going to work. You know, there’s a lot of the nomads here that want to just go from everywhere and and don’t really want to be coached by one person. That’s okay, too. You know, but um we kind of have a system and a standard and we, you know, we close the go close the doors for sparring. Not everybody’s going to come in here and not everybody’s going to see what we do. I feel like we’re doing something very special here and very different and and and it’s paying off. it’s showing, you know, and so we want to keep that together. And if people you want to come in and be part of it, then you’re going to put in the work that everybody else puts in. You think Morab is like the best example of your system and the effectiveness of it right now or do you have another one that comes to mind who may worked with for longer? I mean, there’s been a lot over the years and obviously Morab is the best because look at what he’s doing. That guy is the best in the world, if not the best fighter in the world right now. So, it’d be hard to say that he’s not the best example because clearly, you know, the results are there. But I think that there’s multiple um results and examples of of lots of people that have come here over the years and we we really focus on the fighter and what they need. As far as a coach, I feel like I can I can mesh and blend to anybody style. You know, I’m a true and true MMA coach. I don’t have one specialty. I’m not the best at everything, but I’m pretty darn good at a lot of things. and and and especially when it comes to MMA, you know, there’s a lot of little intricate things that we tweak and fix and it it makes a big difference in in fighting and I don’t think anybody has uh ever come here and not been successful, you know, like it’s been going on for a long time, you know, like I always say Roxanne was a great, you know, Roxan Mafari was one of my greatest, you know, probably I I like one of my best examples of somebody who maybe wasn’t even supposed to be a fighter or wasn’t supposed to be, you know, maximized her potential. Yeah. And we maximize her potential all the way to a title run to this to that, you know. So, whatever it it just takes a little bit of talent and toughness and willingness and and that can go pretty far here. Uh, in terms of like I feel like all the coaches have their own philosophies of like, you know, the type of stuff they want to work on. What’s like a an MMA trend that you’ve seen in the past like year or two that you implemented into your system and then maybe some stuff that you’ve seen that you’ve chopped off because you thought this no longer works the way the sport is evolving. Yeah. I mean, one thing myself is is the specialty coaches. You know, there’s always everybody claims that they’re an MMA coach or they’re this or that. You got these striking coaches. doesn’t mean great striking coaches might work for for for MMA, but like if you don’t understand the game, if you don’t know what the ground game is, if you don’t know how to work a cage, if you don’t know how to work on a wall, if you don’t know whatever, you’re not really an MMA coach. You know, you’re a coach. You could be a specialy coach, but what we do is like everything that’s implemented from every one of my coaches is the fact that they must know MMA. My striking coaches do jiu-jitsu. They they they wrestle. They pay attention. They need to know if I’m not there that that what is being taught is very similar and what you know they all we all have a standard in a system. So I don’t really do the specialist thing anymore like MMA I believe is its own thing. I believe it’s become its own sport and striking is different when you can involve takedowns. Takedowns are different when you can involve striking you know and you have to be able to work it forwards and backwards and left and right up down all around. So realistically just making sure that like the need for the one thing like I said we do here differently is everybody is an MMA coach. You better know the ground. You’ve got to know the standup. You’ve got to know every area to make sure um and so we don’t really like I said have many specialists. My jiu-jitsu coaches, my two black belt, you know, head coaches, Shane and Jerry Shapiro, both MMA fighters, very good MMA fighters. And and they know, you know, when they’re teaching jiu-jitsu, if there’s fighters in there, they they make the changes for the fighters. I love it when they’re, you know, a class of 100 people and they’ll go to the fighter, hey, if you want for fighting, we’re doing this, we’re doing that. So, we got a really, like I said, a special system and thing going on here. In terms of like actual technique, like I had Michael Ki on the show a couple weeks ago, and he was talking about, I think it was right after we got another spinning elbow knockout and then just got another one last weekend with Sergio Pettis and he was like, I think this is going to happen more and more because people are figuring out how to counter the overaggression, use that move and stuff. Is that something you’ve kind of picked up on as well? Oh man. Well, I will say uh we had a a UFC fighter in here today during sparring rounds and and dropped and stopped somebody with a spinning elbow. So, and it was beautiful. Um and those are the things they’re hard to like train in practice. Thank god she big elbow a big elbow pad on, but it just hit perfect and it was like because you got to be careful throwing those things. But I I think there’s a time and a place for everything. And that’s what I always try to tell like there is no one there is no one path in a fight. you know, something that might work in the first doesn’t work in the second. Something that that didn’t work in the first might work in the third. You know, um you just have to be able to adapt. And that’s what, like I said, the biggest thing we do here is train MMA. And it’s not about it’s not so much about like what works, it’s about what doesn’t work and when it doesn’t work, what you do with that. You know, making making mistakes into techniques. Everybody focuses so much on, hey, we got to be perfect and do this is like MMA is so ugly and sloppy sometimes. Let’s make that ugly and sloppiness effective, you know. So, every technique has has a thing. And we’re still growing and adapting and like the crazy [ __ ] like, you know, the calf kick didn’t evolve until a couple years ago. And, you know, now people are starting to to know how to to defend a calf kick. So, you’re seeing less and less. Sometimes they still work, but people, you know, you check a calf kick, it hurts. So, learning how to stop and do those things, but everything is on the table. And that’s the crazy the the the good and the bad about MMA is like you just don’t know what the hell is going to happen. What’s your philosophy on closed guard from bottom? Do you hate it or do you tell I’m not going to say the first word that came to my mind, but anybody who knows me knows what I was going to say. So, um I I just think you’re looking at, you know, getting beat up. If you close your guard from the bottom and you want to stay there, feel free. We’ll stay there. We’ll hang out. That’s something that we work on. If you somebody close their guard, in fact, you’ll hear me and a fight. Guards closed, just go to town. Yeah. Have fun, you know, wait and just don’t get crazy. And eventually after you beat them up a little bit, they’ll open up and go and make the go. But I’m I’m not a big fan. Not a big fan either. I think that’s something that’s should have been phased away. But old school jiu-jitsu, when I came up in jiu-jitsu, I loved closed guard because I could play guard and and you know, I used to hit arm bars and triangles all the time. You can’t get that in jiu-jitsu anymore because no one plays closed guard. Everybody’s moving so much. MMA, terrible idea. Yeah, I would love to see like the stats of like arm bars, triangles, all those things from bottom because it just feels like it’s plummeted in this, you know, has to be. It’s changed so much when I roll. I’m just like, “Hey, stop. Come here. Just come.” You know, you can’t play bottom anymore. It’s crazy. I asked Morab this question the leadup to the fight when he was saying like, “I’m going to knock him out.” All that stuff. And you know, great way to build the fight. But I said to him, like, you look at the George St. appears the Jon Jones is like what made them so amazing and such great champions is they got to a point where they had not only like beat you but they had beat you at what you said you were the best at coming into the fight. Yeah. So like for him I mean he almost got it but is that like the level you’re seeing him get on even if that maybe that wasn’t his intention going in there? Like is that how good this guy’s getting? Yes, absolutely. People think I’m getting when I I I say like listen you better watch out for a strike and you better watch out for submissions. Oh, he’s not this, he’s not that. Well, he’s going to be. And I told everybody, Corey is a very good fighter and if we don’t finish him, which he’s hard to finish, it won’t be for lack of trying. And had we, you know, a little more experience, like that’s a great experience for Morab because now Morab knows that he can knock somebody out at that high elite level, he is going to do it. We just need to settle down in that moment, take a step back, throw a couple more punches, and we probably finish that fight. But that he just gets so excited and he’s been one way for so long, he’s ready to grab you, take you back down, and start mauling you. So, it’s just getting a mindset and getting Morab’s mindset wrapped around something. And once he does, it’s insane. Like, you will not see you’ll see him now, probably when he comes back into camp, which will probably be next week, you he’ll just start dropping people in sparring. You know, he really will have that thing. But it it’s nasty. Like I said, once he believed that he could submit somebody, he’s in here submitting the entire went from no submissions to submitting everybody multiple times around. And we’re not we’re talking about highle good guys. He’s going to start doing the same with the standup. whatever he puts his mind to the man is an like it’s so crazy because it just looks chaotic to the naked eye. People go, “Oh, he’s not this, he’s not that.” Get in there with him and and just see how the timing is because everybody thinks everybody thinks everybody sees the same thing I see. You know, it doesn’t look pretty, but it doesn’t look pretty for a reason. We’re going to keep it not looking pretty, but it’s going to be very beautiful to us when we do what we need to do. He’s just going to keep getting better. He I’m I’m telling you, he’s at like 60% right now. 70% max. his ceiling. I don’t know if there is a ceiling for this man. He can just He’s just a He’s just a savage dude. No, he seems like he’s doing some very special stuff right now. Um I know you’re kind of like, will he overrule? If they make this December fight happen, you’ll just accept it and get him ready. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Like no push back. Yeah. If he if he one, I would never stop him from doing what he wants to do. Two, he’s in here training. No matter training camp or non-training camp, he trains the same way. It doesn’t change. So, if he has a fight, literally, I swear his sparring rounds are harder than his fights. What he does in here on a daily basis is harder than he fights. It really is. And, you know, we throw the book at him trying to get him, you know, in bad spots and positions. And that’s why he always goes out there and he’s like, man, he was like, “You’re right, coach. That was a lot easier than I thought.” You know, and uh it’s just so if he wants to go out and and and get a big paycheck and break records, who am I to stop him? You know, he’s going to do the same thing anyways. The only thing different is he has to cut weight, you know, and that’s he’s not a huge fan of that. But did he do something different this time? I thought someone had mentioned that maybe he changed it up a little bit. He did. So his weight cuts are generally terrible. Like as far as he just has an old school path of most resistance mindset. If it doesn’t hurt and kill me, it’s not working. So he would starve himself for literally come Sunday, Monday, you know, he would already be no water, no food. And I’m when I say no water, no food, I’m talking no water, no food. He would literally starve himself for the week and by Tuesday he was already dying. By by Wednesday when we’re doing media and stuff, he’s just, you know, and everybody was just like, “Are you okay?” You know, and so this time we convinced him to finally eat and drink, you know, and just eat a little bit like eat, you know. The PI came over, Charles from the PI said, “Here, here’s what you can do.” And we got him on some food, got him on some water for the week and whole different person. Whole different person. Everybody was just like, “What’s what? What’s your yoke? It’s good, you know.” And so he had life to him. We tried the bathtub deal. And he just so dead said again, he’s one of those guys that I want to work it off. I want to this. And I’m like, you could do it easier ways. I don’t really care about how he gets it off when it comes to that point. It’s leading up the eating and drinking, just not having to suffer for an entire week. So that was a huge win. We dropped a couple pounds in the bathtub and then he was like, “No, I got to run.” And so he still he got up and ran the rest of it off. Great. You know, I I think that worked out better. And like I said, if we can get him to eat and drink again during fight week, much happier guy. Much better. Just everything. So we’ll tweak a little things, but you know, Morav knows his body, so how he wants to do things. If it isn’t broke, I’m not going to fix it. trying to make things easier for him, but also he he’s it’s he’s the boss when it comes to it. Um Potrion was on Ariel’s show today. I think he said he was 50% for the first fight. I was just talking about this with Lorisenko in the last thing like you know the first Alex Pereira Ankolia fight Pereira was 40%. Now Ankolive had injured ribs like there’s always something and it seems like this always you know this is just the way the sport is now. Everyone has to say something but when you hear that um I don’t know with pot like does that does that make you think about first fight? Do you feel like you guys got the best of Pota the first time around? Oh, absolutely. I mean, say whatever you got to say to build the fight. Like I said, I’m I’m I’m a I’m a Yan fan. That was a little disappointing. It’s like, oh my god. Okay, well now we’ve got to go out there and do you worse than we did the first time. And so it just to prove a point and and I think Rob will, you know, um you also got a Rob that was 50% also in in skill set. he is so much better than when they first fight and that second fight’s going to be so much worse for him. And the fact that he said that I’m just like I, you know, and I don’t know if he’s actually saying it, if there’s people behind the scenes writing the [ __ ] for him, but it’s like, dude, just shut up. Like you’re a fantastic fighter. Like I said, nothing but respect for him and his camp and it’s great. But you start to see things like that. It’s like, dude, come on, man. Like everybody’s Don’t take the [ __ ] fights then, guys. If you’re gonna come out crying, I got hurt ribs. I got hurt. getting out here again. Don’t take the fight then if you don’t want to do it. If you’re so banged up that you think you’re compromised or that that’s the part that got it, don’t take the fight. If you take the fight, I tell any of my guys, we’re all banged up. We’re all injured. If you want to take the fight, take it. Whatever happens, it’s on you. It’s on you. You get your ass whooped. We’re not blaming injuries. We’re not doing this. And you’ll never The one thing you will never hear Rob come out and say, “I was this was that.” There’s so many times he’s been injured and so many can’t say [ __ ] all I’ve said it like he never said anything about the Umar fight but like I said miserable terrible fight like to the point where I didn’t want him to do it. I’m glad he did but like I know what he did on like how bad that was. Come on. And even in for the Yan fight there’s things that were going on in that fight. I could tell you right now I could tell you in fact I think we posted his hand was completely broken and it was the size of a football the week before that fight. Who cares, you know? Like if you’re going to take the fight, take the fight. like don’t come out and you know especially years later and and and say whatever but good sell the fight I don’t care it’s all good [ __ ] board material right is that kind of a thing in the sport do you believe in that as well I I I mean I just think you’re you know you’re going to try to build it and put yourself in the best position you can to get the fight and say whatever you need to say and great we were 50% too cool it’s a fine line everyone deals it with it differently right like I don’t think uh the Alex Pereira stuff that’s not a guy you need to fuel and Morav kind of seems the same like he’s already got enough motivation the last thing you need to do is urge the sky on more than he already is. I I’m actually happy that that came out today because that sets a whole different tone. Morav’s actually been very nice and friendly and and and he’s a respectful guy. You start saying things like that, that just puts the the fuel on the fire. And if I don’t know, like if I’m everybody, I’m not trying to I’m not trying to do that. We not that we need that, but I know it’s interesting. Um, I know the first fight like or I guess do you see that being a vastly different fight second time around? Like Per he’s got a couple good wins and I know he seems confident that he was able to stop the takedowns I guess more consistently but he couldn’t get his back off the cage. I see it being a much worse fight for him. I just I just don’t see again respectfully really a big fan of that guy. I love, you know, I think he’s a good dude and I love watching him fight, but I do not see anything there that would be um a different threat for us and there’s so many more things that’ll be a different threat for him. Uh before I let you go, we’re taking a lot of time here. What’s what’s coming up next for you? Like what’s your next big one around the corner in your mind? So this weekend, fly out to Texas. I got the Brennan brothers, Lucas and Tyler Brennan, uh fighting in Texas and come back weekend after that, Canada for Davy Grant. Um, and then we’ve got uh Jaclyn Kavocante, Luana Santos, uh Muen Gafar, uh a bunch goes on and on and on. Others in camp right now. Yeah, I think Andre Phel is trying to jump on a car. We got um Chepe Mars call looking for a fight. I think maybe an Abu Dhabi. We got It’s just It’s every weekend, you know, for the next foreseeable future is booked up. And then Morav’s just chomping at the bit to to tell me that he’s going to get that fight and then it’s it’s back to the chaos. What do you think percentage on that that he that he fights on December 6th? I think I know for a fact I talked to him today 100% he wants it. 100% he wants it. It’s just a matter of if if when he goes and meets with Hunter if you know what they want. The UFC is going to do what they want and I’ I’ve heard some kind of the backend stuff of what actually why they would or wouldn’t and it makes sense. Um, Morav’s just going to have to push for it. If he really wants it, he’s going to have to push for it. And I really think they should let him do it. I really do. Like, I feel like let him break the record. He’s done so much. He is a company guy. He is He is the dude that they want right now. He’s a great champion. He’s a people, you know, he he loves being a champion. The people love him. He’s he’s just, like I said, he’s couldn’t ask for a better guy right now. And he’ll do whatever you need him to do. So, I I hope they let him have it just for the sake of him wanting it. and and then yeah, I think I think it’s 50/50 right now. It’s he’s just being so amazing. I give him the opportunity. This guy’s on a special run right now. And you just look I mean I probably said going into the Umar fight like obviously they’re both great, but like this division is just so skilled and so deep. Like I don’t see anyone holding the title for three, four title defenses. Here he is. He’s died all in a freaking year. So like that should show. And he’s made this division somehow seem like not as deep as it was before cuz he’s beating everyone so thoroughly. So could not be more impressive. I mean, next couple wins here was looking at threatening Anderson Silva’s all-time winning streak. Like, this is a a once in a-lifetime fighter. And if you go back to the guy that, you know, people maybe weren’t as much behind as they are now, like he shows what you can do in the sport with, you know, success and determination and all that. 100%, man. Like, and he deserves it all. Like, he he’s the he is a sincerely true good person. Great heart, giving to his teammates. He’ll be here like he’s here for his teammates, his family, his people, his country. He’s legitimately just like one of the best people I know and he deserves everything that he has earned and getting right now and and even more, you know, and and he did it the hardest possible way. The UFC did not want that guy to be champion. They really didn’t. But he also has developed himself into being an entertaining fighter, you know, like 10 fights ago, no one would have guessed like, holy [ __ ] he’s he’s almost knocking guys out or submitting Shawn Omali and, you know, like running through these guys that are supposedly more skilled and dangerous and bigger and taller and longer, you know. So, he’s just doing special things and he’s going to continue to do special things and I really I I I truly in my gut it’s it’s MMA so anything can happen on any given night but I think he’s going to break all the records like kind of what Sean Ali said like I don’t know if you saw those comments like you need to knock him out I’m the guy most capable and I believe that like you said anything can happen in this sport like it doesn’t seem like anyone’s going to outwill him outpace him out you know do whatever for to beat him 49 46 or even 48 47 like you got to do the MMA thing where something you can’t calculate or prepare for and it just is the craziness of the sport. When it happens, if it ever happens, it’s all of us are going to be like, “Oh my god, that was no one saw that.” You know, Sean, I I I I like that dude more and more. He’s pretty funny online. You know, him and Tim are are good guys. And uh the [ __ ] that he posts, man, I legit laugh at it. And he, you know, I don’t think he takes himself too serious. And I do believe Sean’s a great fighter. And I do believe he can still win a lot of fights, man. Like, he really is. Like, he’s a talented guy. And and there’s again what you just said, the division below Morab, there’s a lot of guys that could be champion that top five, Corey, Shawn, Yan, Umar, they’re they’re killers, dude. They’re all top 10, you know, they’re all even Batista, like that guy is so underrated, uh, you know, great fighter, make you look bad. That top 10, they’re all killers. And it’s just like, you know, they’re going to have to sit around and fight each other for a while. Yeah. It’s just, it’s just different, you know. It’s just different. Congrats on helping him get to that level, man. It’s uh it’s very cool. I appreciate you letting me in here because I haven’t had the opportunity. I definitely like to come back at some point and see the full practice, but congratulations, man. You deserve it all. Thank you. I appreciate it, man. It really is an honor to have anybody. It’s still shocking to me that anybody wants to interview me or talk to me about anything, but I appreciate it. You’ve been doing your thing for a while, so I appreciate that. Um that does it for this edition of the Bonfire Podcast. Uh we’ll see you all back here next week by the Bonfire.
Laura Sanko returns to “The Bohnfire” podcast to talk UFC 320 aftermath, the rise in injury excuses and the latest in MMA news. Then, Syndicate MMA coach John Wood takes a deep dive into Merab Dvalishvili’s greatness and some of his philosophies.
Timestamps and chapters:
0:00 – Welcome to The Bohnfire!
1:00 – Laura Sanko discusses DWC
4:45 – Alex Pereira’s UFC 320 win, what’s next
9:40 – Merab Dvalishvili: 2025 Fighter of the Year
13:20 – Conor McGregor’s USADA suspension
15:45 – Will Ronda Rousey return to UFC?
17:40 – Who will fight Ilia Topuria next?
21:10 – Laura breaks news on next commentary gig
24:00 – John Wood joins The Bohnfire!
30:30 – Who can train at Syndicate MMA?
34:00 – Wood on trends in MMA training, fights
39:00 – How Merab Dvalishvili is levelling up
41:00 – Will Merab fight again in December?
41:55 – How Dvalishvili changed UFC 320 weight cut
43:45 – Petr Yan claiming he was 50% in loss
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